Mixed workout

[Moonduck]

So, here's my workout overall. Not gonna go into reps and sets as I change them up based on how I feel each day. This is a general guideline of how a week goes. I change my workout days around too. It's both a matter of external pressures (family, career), and soft internal stuff like how energetic I feel.

Sunday - MTB'ing on trails in a local park, usually about 45-60 minutes worth

Monday - weight training
-Bench up to 3-5RM
-Horizontal Rows
-Deadlift up to 3-5RM
-Chin ups scattered here and there
-Dips (chair, with feet elevated, as I'm not quite up to doing a reasonable number of reps full-on)
-Other lifting as I feel like it (bent presses, random isolation work, etc)
-Finish up with some sparring and MA work

Tuesday - rest day

Wednesday - kettlebells
-Turkish Get Ups
-Alternating Clean and Press
-Alternating Snatches
-Other work as I feel like it
-Swings using the Tabata protocol

Thursday - Bodyweight day, or more weight-training, same as above
-Dips same as above
-Horizontal rows
-Chin ups here and there
-Handstands and work on HSPU's
-Burpees if I want the cardio

Fridays and Saturdays are generally very busy, and I workout however I can.

I was doing two sessions each of kettlebells and weights each week, but that proved to be pushing it a bit much. I'd like to keep more weight-lifting in, but it's tough for my usually lifting partner to get her more than once a week. Sucks.

Oh, forgot to mention mobility work. Every day, rain or shine, feeling good or feeling bad, I do mobility work. I've got a routine that takes 10-15 minutes each morning and works every major joint and muscle groups (using BW only) enough to keep me mobile and feeling good. It's probably the single most useful thing I do overall.

I also add in a fair amount of BW exercises in a GTG style throughout the week as I feel like it, and occassionally do pilates with my wife for core work. I really try to listen to my body and do what I feel like I need to do. An example would be Thursday night. I ate a bit much at Thanksgiving and was desperate for some serious cardio. My schedule didn't free up till almost 1030pm, but I grabbed my bike and went out anyway.

I try to stay somewhere between chaos and rigid systemised workouts. I probably lean more towards chaos than anything else.

[Moonduck]

Changed things around a bit.

Sunday - High Volume day
5 increasing supersets of
5 x 50% 8RM
5 x 75% 8RM
5 x 100% 8RM
with no rest between weights other than however long it takes my workout buddies to swap out the plates.

These supersets are done with bench press and deadlift.

Monday - feeder workout to recover from Sunday
5 sets of 10 x 50% 8RM on same two exercises

Wednesday - medium volume, test for 1RM
5 Increasing supersets of
5 x 50% 8RM
5 x 75% 8RM
with no rest between sets, same as before.

Then we check 1RM. Well, more like 90% 1RM. We do Bench one week and dead the next. It's essentially a series of singles done with increasing weight, with adequate rest between sets. Not using any real mental effort, so they aren't true one-rep maximums. We also don't tend to push hard, as this program is not intended to increase 1RM. It's more for hypertrophy and strength-endurance (Modified deLorme Cycle).

It started at 10RM being the marker, and has gone up progressively since then, thus the reason I mentioned 8RM above.

I was doing chin-ups and pull-ups GTG style, doing one of each every time I passed my chin-up bar. That worked beautifully, until my wrists really started hurting badly. I took a few days off from the chin/pull routine and tested for new max. I was able to do 7 pull-ups, and I am very hppy about that considering that I couldn't even do one pull-ups 2 months ago. Bowadays, in dference to the wrists, I only do the pull-ups occassionally, never to serious volume. Less painful that way.

I've also had to cut back on my push-ups, as flat palm supports were painful due to the wrist. As a result, my daily mobility work has been somewhat hampered, as the push-up and other flat palm supports figured in a number of the movements. I'm thinking about getting push-up bars, as bench pressing doesn't bother my wrists at all. It's all flat palm pressing and pulling motions that hurt.

And, while it is not even remotely BW, I set a new PR on the deadlift tonight - 410lbs. I'm pretty jazzed about that, especially considering my previous PR was 355lbs. Pretty solid jump in a coupla months time IMO. Still not big weights, but it's getting better and that is all that matters.

[cheesedog]

Well first, big congratulations on the new PR. It always feels great setting some new numbers. 410# isn't anything to sneeze at. 8)

I never heard of deLorme, but I'll check him out. Sounds interesting.

A quick question, on your first entry you were doing horizontal rows followed by deadlifts, did you find that causing any back strain? I just completed a fairly high-rep program where I was, at the end, doing deadlifts with 215# for 3 sets of 12 reps, and after that my back was FRIED. I never felt a pump in my spinal erectors before!

Have you tried doing pushups on your fists rather than on palms? It's easier on your wrists that way, especially if you ever had carpal tunnel problems.

[Moonduck]

Damn, I had this huge reply and the computer ate it. I'll post again later, but I gotta head out for work now.

[Moonduck]

Nope, no strain on nights when I did rows and deads. Then again, I keep to low reps on deads pretty religiously. The deadlift really requires great form to do it safely. I'd rather lift heavy and at low reps so as to keep my form tight. Partially I do it because that is just how I train, and partially because one of my workout partners has a bad back. He can pull singles for 325# at 175# bodyweight, so he's doing pretty good, but I don't want him getting tired and slipping. Safer, in my experience, to do sets of 4-6 reps.

We're actually in the process of constructing a reverse hyper for glute-ham work, as the stuff I've read says it is the movement to do for folks with low back issues.

as an aside, I pulled a LOT last night. 50 reps total at varying weights, and then singles with escalating weight, jumping about 20# per single til I hit 410#. That's a LOT of volume (it totalled out to about 5 tons, though the average intenisty was low). But by keeping the reps low per set, I allowed for adequate rest periods. Combining that with doing controlled drops instead of lowering the weight (which is what you're supposed to do with deads anyway) means my back has no problems today. I figured a new, and heavy, PR would kill me the morning after. Nope, nothing. I feel the normal (and comfortable) tightness that I expect after a normal workout. That's it.

I've tried push-ups on dfists, but it throws me off badly. I use whole body tension techniques, and not having my palms down screws with my proprioception. I can't grip the floor or apply torsion through my palms, so my form feels messed up. Also fist with nothing t grip is similarly confusing for the muscles. I've been thinking about push-up handles or blast straps, because then I could just do a bench ress type movement and I wouldn't feel so wierd.

[cheesedog]

You're wise to watch the form on deadlifts. A great exercise, but you gotta respect it! Even when I was doing the high-rep thing with deads, I did them one at a time, reseting for every rep. I got soreness in the glutes and up between the shoulder blades, but not in the low back.

Those reverse hypers are great, I used to have access to one at a gym, now that I work out at home I miss it. When I have the money and space that's gonna be one of my first purchases, right after a power rack.

I know what you mean about the fist pushups at first, they take some getting used to. I recently got some pushup bars and have been using them. They're nice, especially the stretch you can get at the bottom.

[Moonduck]

Hey, doing onesies like that is the safest way to do it. I wasn't trying to give you grief on the high-rep thing, by the way. I know folks that do high reps on deads too. It just doesn't work for me.

New York Barbell looks to have the best deal going on a basic power rack. I'm not looking for much, and not being a really heavy lifter, I'm not looking to get a super-beefy rack. The research I've done says that their stuff works, and it is a good deal, so my workout buddies and I are gonna go in together on one.

The reverse hyper project looks cool. Right now it's just a pile of lumber in my garage, but it looks like it will go together fairly easily. All I have left to get is something for handles and some sort of cover for the bench. I plan to take pics of the construction process. If it works out, I'll post em here.

I've been thinking about those push-up bars. I built some wannabe blast straps. Gonna give those a shot.

[cheesedog]

Oh, I didn't think you were giving me grief or anything! Actually, I had never done high reps on deads before. (Also squats and bench presses.) I got really nice results from them, more muscle,more endurance, lost some fat, but I really found them wearing on me, both physically (kickboxing is no fun a day after high-rep squats) and mentally, I really started getting bored with the workouts.

Still, I don't want to lose the endurance I built up. So it looks like I'll have to do some kind of high-rep workout occasionally to keep it. Oh well, something to experiment with..... :)

[Moonduck]

Well, the gains make sense. After a while, the body adapts to pretty much anything. I figure once I get my squat rack and I adapt to my usual routine of low-rep high-weight, I'll give Strossen's 20-rep squat program a try. Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger, right? =)

As to endurance, I read an article by Dan John last night where he talked about doing too much low-rep work and it having a negative effect on how much pop he had in his Olympic lifts. I gues sin my case it is just my own programming when it comes specifically to deadlifts. I just can't wrao my brain around high-rep deadlifts. *shrug* Whatever works, right?

[cheesedog]

IMO, Dan John is one of the best writers out there. T-nation has a bunch of his articles and they all rock! His website is good too, especially if you're into the Oly lifts.

Yeah, I'm playing around with the idea of the 20-rep squat workout too. I'll wait awhile though, until I'm sure the old knees are up to it.

Whatever works? Remember, grasshopper, there are many paths to the top of the mountain! :wink: :)

[Moonduck]

I really, really dig the oly lifts. Unfortunately they are freaky hard to self-teach. Doing them based off of what I read has lead to a very sore Moonduck more than once, and some very unimpressive lifts, weight-wise.

As an aside, I've picked up Mark Rippetoe's "Starting Strength" and it is really impressing me. I'm currently still in the chapter on how to squat properly, and thus how to teach the squat properly, and I can honestly say that I've learned quite a bit. I'm really looking forward to the chapter on the Power Clean, as that is a movement that I am really keen on. As I mentioned before, I'm interested in the Oly lifts, and Rippetoe's explanation style and coaching cues have been really impressive so far.

I've also been thinking about getting Dan John's oly lifts DVD. I've heard good things about it. Between Dan John, Dave Tate, and a couple of other writers, T-Nation has become one of my favourite websites for training ideas and info. If they could get Clarence Bass doing articles for them I'd be done =)

[cheesedog]

Yeah, I'm self taught on the Oly lifts too, and my lifts are, well, let's just say less than impressive. :oops: But I've never really spent as much time on them as I should. Aspiring Olympic style weightlifters spend ALOT of time practicing the 2 main lifts with lighter weights before they really start bumping up the weight.

My plan right now is to do the next cycle focusing on limit strength and then next work more of the oly lifts, although that may change as time passes.

T-nation is one of my favorite websites, along with this one. Really cutting edge stuff there!

[Moonduck]

Yeah, I'm pretty happy with this site too. It's less glitzy than T-nation, of course, but you get less trolls here.

I think that with Oly lifts, working the precursors and going through the actual training patterns would do me a world of good. Front squats> high pulls > jump shrugs > etc. In other words, do all the learning lifts to get used to the individual movements. Right now, I'm just sort of physically guessing on how to do these based on what I've seen. That's no good, and leaves my big ass sore.

I had my wife do some of the precursor stuff. Her shoulder flexibility is unreal, as she did competitive swimming years ago. Where I'm marginal at best on overhead squats, she can do them (with light weights) without even straining. Her shoulders and balance are killer. It makes me want to get her doing oly lifts just because her body is better set up for it than mine =P

Well, that and I would like to see her exercise more. She gripes about her body composition, but won't do anything consistent about it. I have tried a couple of different things just trying to find something that sticks. I may try to ge ther interested in the oly stuff. The non-heavyweight female oly lifters have awesome bodies, and oly workouts, while brutally hard, don't take all that long.

I would really like to get her working out with me, as I think it would help her to have a workout partner. And my normal lifting buddies won't even think about trying oly lifts, if I could get the wife doing it...

[cheesedog]

I know what you mean, some of the guys at T-nation are pretty nasty.

I'm doing front squats on the new cycle I started today. With dumbells though, until my wrists are a little more flexible. As of now, Overhead squats are completly impossible, shoulders are just to tight. I'm working on it.

I'm lucky, my wife likes to work out. We even work out at the same time on some days. I'll be in the corner lifting while she does the elliptical machine. I've got her doing pushups, squats, crunches, etc. She's pretty strong, alot of MEN can't do 20-25 pushups. She doesn't care to much for weights though.

[Moonduck]

Nice!

I actually talked to my wife about it today. She said that she'll be willing to do a short workout on Fridays. I figure we'll do some Olympic precurosrs and move into oly lifts. Good stuff for short, hard workouts. With her flexibility, and lack of fear of the lifts, she's almost interested. I'm pretty fired up about it. I really dig the idea of working out with her. I hope she follows up with her word on this.

Now I just have to feverishly prep for it, and read everything I can on getting these movements down pat.

[cheesedog]

There's some good articles on the Olympic lifts at deepsquatter.com, and mikes gym.org has a bunch of articles and a "workout of the day" section thats kind of a "crossfit" type workout only focusing on the oly lifts. Some really good stuff there!

[Moonduck]

I'll check into it, thanks!

[Moonduck]

Tested for 1RM in bench last night and bumped it up to 245#. Not bad, considering my 1RM from two weeks ago was 225#. My bench still blows diseased goat chunks, but I will happily take a 20# inscease in 1RM in a two week period.

We have two more weeks on this cycle. As much as I hate it, I have to admit that it is working. I've added 40# to my bench and 70# to my deadlift. I have probably gained some muscle too, but it's tough to ell as my BF% is still too high.

Also, my diet is not conducive to muscle gain either, as I'm still more interested in losing fat than I am gaining muscle. I flux my intake up and down dpending on daily activity. If I'm going to be lifting, I up my intake about midday to load up a bit. It's not a huge jump, but it is noticable. I also add in a bit more carbs (I am on a low-carb diet in general) to reload needed glycogen reserves. The day after I lift I tend to eat a bit more as well, roughly until midday again. Same deal, a few more cals, a bit more carbs at breakfast, that sort of thing.

It seems to be doing okay. I've got to tinker with it, as I've gained weigt overall since I started eating this way, but my waist hasn't gone up precipitously, so I'm assuming that much of the gain is due to muscle. As my goals vacillate between strength gain and body composition, I'm walking a tightrope anyway. It's tough to gain muscle and lose fat, regardless of what the infomercials say.

[cheesedog]

245# isn't bad at all, my 1 rep max for bench is only about 200. I've always been alot stronger on pulling movements than pushing. I think it might have something to do with growing up on a farm, I was always pulling and carrying heavy stuff, not nearly as much pushing.

Is this the deLorme cycle you were talking about earlier?

I've tried the low carb diet a couple of times in the past. I lost some fat but my strength went way down too. It's discouraging when your 5 rep max is now your 1 rep max! Nowadays I try to keep the carbs under 150 grams a day, and get them from whole grains, fruit and vegetables. The fat loss is slower but so far the strength gains are coming along.

You diet, especially with the way you vary your intake based on your activity, sounds very solid.

[Moonduck]

Thanks for the positive feedback! Here's hoping the diet works out.

I'm in the same boat vis a vis push-pull. I always find pulling to be a stronger movement for me. I've spent my whole life working on cars, and you can generally choose which angle you want to hit a given nut/bolt from. I've always found that I can exert more force pulling than I can pushing. Just one of those things, I guess.

And, yes, the cycle I was referring to is the modified deLorme Cycle. I can provide you with the specifics if you'd like. I despise it, sure, but it works bloody well.

As to carbs, everybody is different. If I eat a slice of pizza, 30-60 minutes later I feel like I wanna die. My energy levels crash SO bad. This realisation makes it a bit easier for me to avoid the carbs, as I know my reward for cheating too much is going to be horrendous energy crash.

When I started on the low-carb thing, my friends kept saying that I would have no energy, and they were dead wrong. Different bodies have different needs, I say. Carbs don't do much for me, so I eat them only at certain times, as pointed out above.

Worse, they screw with my emotions. For a coupla months, I tried Mauro diPasquale's Anabolic diet. It's an excellent program, and it was working, but the weekly carb-up days left me exhausted and incredibly crabby. My wife hated being around me because I was such a grouch. I got off of it as I prefer to keep my family happy with me =P

You sound like your carb-tolerant. I wish I was =P

[cheesedog]

When you have time I'd like to hear about the deLorme cycle, it sounds interesting.

Funny how different people thrive on different diets. Over the years I've tried just about everything, from vegeterianism (felt tired and sick, lost muscle and gained fat) to Atkins (felt pretty good, lost strength but not muscle, lost fat) to the "blood-type" diet; actually still using a version of it, even though it doesn't seem to have much scientific basis, although it does offer an explaination of why different diets work.

It's great that you're in touch with your system enough to figure out that excess carbs make you grouchy. Most people are clueless about such things.

[Moonduck]

Well, it's another lesson I learned from the high blood pressure diagnosis. As my BP climbed, so did my temper. I became an absolute bear to live with, barking at my wife, yelling at my kids, etc. My wife is eternally patient, and I thank my lucky stars for that. I'm surprised she didn't leave my ass. Well, when I got the hypertension diagnosis, the doc explained that high BP tends to degrade one's mood, leading to anger, etc, and that it was a warning sign of return of hypertension. As a result, I tend to watch my mood like a hawk.

Watching my mood lead to watching other things. I pay attention to my digestion, and avoid foods the cause heartburn. I pay attention to energy levels, and avoid eating habits that hamper them. I watch my joints, my heart rate, blood pressure, sleeping habits, etc. In short, I pay attention to what my body tells me. It's made certain things much easier to take care of. Watching what effect food has on energy levels alone has accounted for a huge upswing in my general quality of life.

I'm not surprised to hear that you lost strength on Atkins. If you're carb tolerant, the lack of proper glycogen loading will leave you flat in the strength department. Hell, even being carb-intolerant, lack of carbs on a workout day leaves me feeling noticably weaker.

I'll put together something on deLorme over the weekend and post it.

[cheesedog]

Thanks, and stay healthy.

[Moonduck]

Added in alovely barbell complex, courtesy of Cheesedog, on Fridays. And, boy, am I feeling it today. Nothing like doing radically different exercises to make new and exciting muscles ache.

Today, as a result, has been stretching, foam rolling, and recovering. I always do a little bit of work on off days (on top of my morning mobility work) just to keep myself moving.

Mostly, it's stretching today. Wow, shoulders are tight.

[cheesedog]

I've been thinking about getting one of those foam rollers. Are they worth it? My shoulders and IT band gets really tight. Daily stretching helps but I'm always looking for more.

[Moonduck]

100% worth it, and one of the single best pieces of recovery gear I've used.

[cheesedog]

Well, it's decided then. As soon as this ice/snow storm clears up I'm gettin' one. Thanks!

[Moonduck]

Good on ya!

On the Oly front, I realised that I have Dan John's book "From the Ground Up" on pdf. Damn, I have so many freakin' books on my computer that I don't even know what I have. Sheesh.

Yesterday's workout, the heavy day for the week, blew chunks. Hard. Large greasey chunks. I've been sick the past coupla days. I felt like a limp frikken noodle on the bench. The deads came up okay, but, damn, my bench was horrid. And the deads just wrecked me. I recovered pretty quickly afterwards, but I felt horrible.

Tonight's a light night, so we're playing around with various things. Did some DE benching with bands for the first time. Total blast. I loved. Speed benching normally kills my elbow, but the bands made the dynamic effort entirely painless. *hugs my Jumpstretch bands*

*After training session*

Aaaand we finished with Tabata Thrusters. Oh man, I hurt. And it's the morning after. I feel like I've been worked over by a drunken Australia rugby team. Light day turned into a ball-buster, all because of 4 minutes of torture. Gah...

[Moonduck]

Been hurting all day. Going up and down stairs has been unadulterated joy. Yay for Tabata. I don't know that any researchers in the history of exercise has ever been so roundly cursed (the morning after) for his successful methods.

[cheesedog]

Tabata thrusters rock! Just keep repeating to yourself as you go up and down the stairs, "pain is good, extreme pain is extremely good!"

Dan John is fond of Tabata front squats. Sound like 4 minutes of hell. :P

[Moonduck]

Well, I didn't have enough dumbbells for all three of us (I'll be correcting that shortly), so I just used an Olympic bar. Sure, 45#, doesn't sound bad, right? Then you do it at exhaustion levels and try, TRY, to keep that 45# from smacking you in the face on the way up and down when you have no good control left. Catching a 45# bar across the nose is no fun. The latter cycles went from what amounted to front squat into push press to back squat into push press, to struggle to get back up from squat and then struggle to military press an unloaded bar because there was no explosiveness left in my legs to do a push press.

(Note: That wasn't meant to sound like a challenge. It was just me whining about how many times I ate the bar, like an idiot.)

I've been thinking about just doing front squats with it, but I figure I should get more upper body work in to really get the blood moving. Then again, unweighted Tabata squats would be sufficient to kill my legs as-is, so maybe that is just me being afraid of the idea =)

Well, tonight is medium night, and test for 1RM in deadlift. Wish me luck. I'm feeling pretty beat up, so I'm not expecting too awful much. I plan to shoot for 425#, with an eye on 440# if I'm feeling really buff..

[cheesedog]

Don't feel bad. 45# can feel like a ton when you're fatigued.

Talking about tabata squats, crossfit has a workout they call "tabata this" where you do a few different bodyweight exercises tabata style back to back. When you get to the fourth minute of pushups and you realize you're not going to get through the last 20 seconds of work without resorting to "girlie pushups" your ego can take a beating. :(

If I remember correctly, the workout was 4 minutes each of squats, rowing machine, pullups, situps, and pushups. It's a killer.

Good luck on the new PR. If you're not feeling up to snuff pay particular attention to form. A tired body and wandering mind are the perfest recipe for injury.

[Moonduck]

That's what happened. I blew it. Managed to bump up to 415#, and could've gotten 420#, but I was concerned about form. When I tried 420, I blew it hard and could feel my back rounding like crazy. Hell, 415# wasn't good. I knew it wasn't going to be a good night when I hit 320# and it felt heavy. I'm sure you know what I mean when I say that.

Still, I pulled a new PR, if only by five measly pounds. Luckily, one of my training partners slapped me into perspective. He asked "So, if you add 5# to your dealdifts every two weeks, where will you be at the end of the year?" "Um, uh, about 530#", says I. "And what's your goal for the year?" he asked.

As my goal is a 500# dead by the end of the year, perspective was firmly returned. I was pulling hard from the crazy gains I made on the test for max prior to this, and hoping for a repeat. After being sick as a dog most of the week, I should've been happy to pull at all, let alone bang out a new PR.

Perspective is a good thing, eh?

[Moonduck]

And that "Tabata this" workout sounds so stunningly insane that there is no way I'd even attempt it. One Tabata cycle of anything is entirely sufficient for my purposes, period. 4 minutes is enough for me, as I am done afterwards. Then again, I tend to do either thrusters, burpees (talk about a puker), or kettlebell swings,

[cheesedog]

Glad you didn't get injured. When your back starts to round on a deadlift, stop! It'd probably be a good idea to lay off the heavy training for a couple days.

Still, a new PR is great, 5 # or not. Congrats! :)

And you're right, Tabata This is a crazy workout. I actually have a goal over the next year or so to get strong enough to be able to follow most of the Crossfit workouts. Their bodyweight and endurance routines aren't TO bad, but the ones that mix heavy weight work with sprints or bodyweight work are just to frikkin' hard. My cardio and muscle endurance are pretty good, but my limit strength sucks.

[Moonduck]

Well, tomorrow is barbell complex day. Gonna use less weight this time, and will probably beg off if the back hurts. Right now, it's pretty good. I've been foam rolling and hitting various trigger points with a tennis ball, and it isn't really even stiff right now. Stiffness and soreness is to be expected. I worked it HARD last night. DOMS is my reward, as usual.

That said, I had a funky shift in the lower back last night. scared me good. I can't describe it really, other than to say that it felt like a vertebrae was thinking about shifting and didn't. Scared me good, and made my erectors stiffen up like crazy as a response. Gotta love autonomic protective responses. It made getting back to sleep a little difficult until I used some relaxation techniques to get the back to smooth out.

Work didn't bother me, include hucking a king-size mattress around with no help. I figure if I can toss around a heavy-ass mattress, my back probably ain't injured, just sore. (I'm flexing and extending my back muscles as I type this with zero pain)

I will have to write a post about trigger points, by the way. I've been having a nagging elbow issue, and I learned a way to hit the trigger points in my forearm to help fix it. My elbow pain has diminished around 80%. I'm a true believer now, and my tennis ball is my new best friend. I've also got a copy of the "Trigger Point Workbook" coming, and will probably post a review of it when it does. I'm even contemplating picking up "The Stick" for rehab.

I have to admit to being very Recovery-focussed. My nutrition, my supplementation, my non-exercise physical activity are all largely focussed towards faster recovery times. It shows too. My training buddies were damned near crippled even two days after the Tabata Thrusters. One of em went so far as to take muscle relaxants last night. Me? I was sore for two days after, but am fine today. Recovery is my friend.

We'll see if my recovery ability will be sufficient to face the threat of the evil barbell complex tomorrow!

[Moonduck]

Did five sets of the barbell complex again tonight with my wife as my training partner. It's still dead cool that she's willing to do this. Her form on the Oly work is getting way better too. Probably getting better than mine really. I can't watch and correct what I'm doing, so it's hard to gauge. All I know is that barbell complexes are WORK.

[cheesedog]

Since you enjoy the pain of complexes SOOOO much, here's a few more!
:lol:
Complex C
1. Pushups with hands on the bar x 6
2. Deadlifts x 6
3. Hang clean x 6
4. Front squat x 6
5. Push press x 6

Complex D
1. Clean x 6
2. Clean and Press x 6
3. Bent row x 6
4. Pushup with hands on bar x 6
5. Deadlift x 6

This one is a little different. You change position halfway through...
Complex E
1. Clean and press x 6
2. Squat thrusts with hands on bar x 6. You drop down, legs shoot back, bring legs back to hands, and stand up with the bar (do a deadlift)
3. Pushups with hands on bar x 6
Move to position underneath a pullup bar.....No rest...!
4. Burpees x 6
5. Pushup x 6
6. Pullup x 6
This one is loads of fun. Have a bucket handy. For even more fun, have your 1st and 2nd station 40 yards from each other and sprint. You can crawl after the 2nd part.


This one made me puke. :oops:

[Moonduck]

Back has been a bit stiff and even hurting a bit since that last deadlift. Sucks. So, I turned to BW. Did more BW stuff than I normally do, though no real workouts. Just the sort of random playing around that I always find to be really stupendously therapeutic. The primary worth I find with BW these days is mobility and recovery. Sure, I could gain strength with it, but the weights are better for that. BW is what keeps me healthy and functional. *shrug* It all has its' place.

Well, tonight was heavy volume night, and I gotta admit I was dreading it. All through the bench protion of the evening my back was hurting. Keeping a tight arch for good position was no fun. When I hit my first set of deads, I really psyched myself out. It was an awful set, my form sucked, and my back hurt.

Then, right as I was about to start my second set, my absolute favourite lifitng song rolled up on my iTunes (Rollins Band "Shine"). Wow, instant energy boost! I grabbed that bar and blasted out an awesome set. The weights were hopping, I felt so light. Good stuff. After that, my form was great and my back didn't hurt at all during the lifts. Yeah, I was still a bit, stiff, but that broke through right when I needed it.

All in all, had a good night. I totally handled weights in the bench that were wrecking me last week. If this continues, I'll PR on Wednesday. I hope to. I want 255# or so. Gonna go for it. Just gotta do like I did today and make sure my nutrition was in line. While my training buddies were starting to bonk, I was straight.

Nutrition really is 50% of success in this game, with attitude being 30% and training less than 20%.

[Moonduck]

That last one is just plain sadistic. Or masochistic, depending on your viewpoint.

I like it :twisted:

[Moonduck]

My back feels pretty darned good today. Just the normal level of tightness I'd expect after a solid deadlift workout.

This is the last week of the DeLorme Cycle, so 415# will be my officially deadlift max for this cycle. We'll test for bench max on Wednesday. Tonight is a light night.

To give an example of what the actual numbers looked like, last night was:

BENCH
5 x 95#
5 x 145#
5 x 195#
For 5 sets, with no rest between subsets

DEAD
5 x 145#
5 x 225#
5 x 295#
For 5 sets, with no rest between subsets

13.75 tons, or 27500# total. Not bad, though at lower intensities than I prefer, as usual. Still, this would fall into RE in the Westside Method, and is thus still a recognised portion of strength training. And, mor eimportantly, it works.

[cheesedog]

Funny how a kickin' song can really push your workout to a new level. For some reason it's mostly been Foo Fighters for me lately.

A tough barbell complex is sadistic when you do it to someone else, and masochistic when you do it to yourself! When that last one made me puke, a friend (who lived 2 floors up ) and me did the first half in my apartment, raced up 2 flights of stairs, and did the second half in his apartment. Right after the 3rd set I yakked. He laughed and then yakked too. :shock: Good times.... :P

Pretty definite about trying out that deLorme cycle soon. Your progress is real encouraging to me.

[Moonduck]

What I like is that it worked for all three of us. One of my training partners has a stocky build like mine, and was largely sedentary like me previously. He gained well from this just like I did. More interesting, the other one is a tall thin type that does contracting work, and is thus constantly active. He actually gaine dmore mucle from this anyone else. He gained serious, visible muscle, though didn't have quite the strength gains we did.

Either way, it is an excellent training program to try for your next cycle IMO, especially as it is so very simple.

[cheesedog]

:D I'm a simple man, and the simpler things are the better!

[Moonduck]

Well, I'm usually a fan of simple things. Better to do one or two things well than 15 things poorly. We'll see how well it works out with what we're doing next. We're still trying to figure out what our next cycle will be. The orioginal plan was a Westside style conjugated PL cycle, but we may need a break from the PL movements. We'll see what happens next.

[Moonduck]

Well, Monday was a light day. We did deads first, with 145# on th ebar for 5 sets of 5 reps. As this is ultimately unsatisfying, I decided to expand it into a clean and jerk at the end of each set, followed by front squat, overhead squat, back squat, good morning, and then 1-5 bent rows. Boredom causes me to drift. These impromptu barbell complexes had the desired effect though. My heart rate was up, and I was puffing and sweating.

Then, not having done enough after the very light benches that followed, we decided to do some band work. 100 tricep pushdowns (Jumpstretch mini-band) in however many sets it took, followed by 100 face-pulls, same arrangment.

Sounds fun, and it was. I was both blasted and entirely pumped up afterwards. Unfortunately, I was still blasted tonight. And, somewhere in there, I pulled a trap somehow. One of my training partners found the knot and worked it out mostly. Unfortunately, the myofascial release wrecked my ability to produce tension just as badly as the pain in my trap wrecked my ability to produce tension anyway. So, as a result, I didn't even hit my previous bench max. I pushed up 235#, and it took everything I had.

To an extent, I think it is overtraining. We'd been pretty consistent about working for four weeks and then having a deload week. These 4-week cycles worked really well for us. The DeLorme Cycle runs for 6 weeks, and I already felt rough last week. This week was worse. Yeah, I made all my cycle lifts this week, but it was HARD. I feel overworked, and I think that's the case. As my two partners, Al and Ron, are feeling the same, I think overtraining is the prognosis.

Next week was scheduled for deload, and we're gonna enjoy it. I've scored a coupla one week guest passes to the local Gold's Gym, and we plan to spend our normal training sessions in a bunny gym, playing with the machines, ogling the ladies, and hitting the hot tubs. Should be good fun. Then it'll be back to business as usual in my garage.

On happier news, Ron came up with some money and has ordered us a power rack. Oh yeah. We'll be able to squat with safety and confidence now.

We're still kicking around what we're doing next though. The cojugated method we were originally looking at will take a bit more preparation. We need to have some more gear built before we can do that. We've made some progress on the Reverse Hyper finally, but no idea on how to do a GHR that will work right, and we still need to slap together some boards for board presses, and some sort of arrangment for chest-supported rows. I've got an idea for a cable and pulley system, but it needs work.

So, next week will be machines and, you guessed it, BW work! And hot tubs. And, if we're lucky, gym bunnes in lycra. Which of course means BBW's in lycra.

[crazydan]

that workkout seems intense. good job. what are bbws in lycra?

[cheesedog]

Yeah, boredom or high spirits sometimes turns my"light days" into something else entirely too!

Your problem sounds like overtraining to me also. It took me WAY too long to finely figure it out, but every 4th week is a light or deloading week for me now. So far the injuries have been far less, and much easier to work around/heal up from. I think when I do the deLorme cycle I'll break into two 3 week cycles with a light week in between.

[Moonduck]

Yup, that was our plan too, if we do it again.

And we are talking about doing it again. The power rack is on the way, and that means lots of squatting. On thing that the DeLorme cycle does well is loads of volume, and volume increases your ability to groove the movement better. So we're thinking that the best way to handle squats is to, well, handle them. Loads of volume at moderate weights will work to increase our ability to handle the movement.

This is, of course, after a break-in period where we are getting used to the movement. No reason to jump in cold with something that brutal.

Now I just have to come up with some other movement tfor the upper body. We've done a LOAD of benching recently, so I'm thinking something more back oriented. I'd say pull-ups, but I can't fine-control the weight on those. Bent-rows may be the thing, but I have to come up with some way to support the chest, else we'll burn out the low-back with all the volume.

BBW = internet slang for overly large women

It was a joke, and a bit of tasteless one. Then again, wearing lycra in public is tasteless, unless you are REALLY in shape, so one tasteless move begets another.

[cheesedog]

How about overhead presses? If you keep your arms more out to the side rather than in front it'll bring in the medial delts more and give the pecs a bit of a rest. Of course, other than traps it doesn't hit the back...
Maybe do the bent rows with your head supported on a bench, with a towel to pad your forehead? I've seen a couple of guys with bad backs do them like that, they say it takes alot of the sress off the low back.

[Moonduck]

I was contemplating overhead presses. I do more than a few of those when I work Oly stuff with my wife though. I don't wanna get my shoulders so blasted that I can't do stuff with her on Fridays.

I've done bent shoulder work on my posterior deltoids with my head supported on a stool. That might work. Then again, I dunno. I can pull some solid weight when doing bent rows. I don't want to think about the stresses on the neck that this would cause.

It's something to think about though. I like the idea of overhead presses, as that is a huge measure of strength for me. Taking a page from Dan John's book, nothing more truly defines raw, unassisted strength better than the ability to pick up heavy shit and put it over your head. My training partners tend to wince, cringe, and goldbrick when I bring up the subject though.

[crazydan]

O GOD i no what you mean I hate when fat people wear spandex

[Moonduck]

Did this one with my wife, at Cheesedog's suggestion:

4-6 Sets of:

This one is from Coach Davies "Renegade Training". It's aptly named "The Bear."

1. Power clean x 1

2. Front squat x 1

3. Front push press x 1

4. Back squat x 1

5. Back push press x 1

Do each movement once one right after the other for 1 rep. Do that a total of 6 times to equal one set. Rest and repeat until you beg for death.

We both did 5 sets. She actually used th eoly bar, and even got a plate on each. A little plate, but I wa shappy to see it anyway. I got up to 100#. Could've gone farther, but was pressed for time. I was also doing hang cleans, again, because of time constraints. I didn't feel like resetting before each pull, and I have to reset as my back is still tight. Way better, but tight. No chances taken right now.

And, to be honest, I'm still feeling overtrained, so I figured I'd take it a bit easy. 100# was a good comfortable weight that I could move fast, yet still felt like weight. No matter what, it got the heart rate up, got me puffing, and sweating. Good stuff.

Thanks again to cheesedog!

[cheesedog]

100# is nothing to sneeze at when you're doing the Bear. Glad you and your wife are enjoying it!

[Moonduck]

Well, my current goal with these barbell complexes is 135#. Hell, I just like to get my snatch to the point where I can pull 135#. My forms completely sucks though, so I can only get around 95-100# in the air on the power snatch. I am not quite fast enough to duck under the bar and do a proper snatch into overhead squat. It is annoying too, as I can overhead squat 135#. I am just not quite able to snatch it.

I wish I could find an Oly lifting club around here.

[cheesedog]

Man, it'd be awesome to be able to do a complex with 135#!

[Moonduck]

I'm pretty sure I'll be there by the end of March, or April at the latest, if things keep going like this. Right now weight is going up quick, as it is more a matter of getting the movments down properly, and getting my endurance up to par.

[cheesedog]

Have you tried doing a split snatch rather than the squat snatch? Depending on your body type you might find them easier. It is for me. And also since my shoulders are to tight (for now, I'm working on it) to do full squat snatches. The last cycle I did the Oly lifts I worked up to 150# for a single of split snatches.

The problem with using them for a complex, though, is since you move your feet for each rep your rhythm gets broken. For that I had to go with a power snatch, just barely dipping down, maybe about a 1/4 squat. That really cuts down on the weight.

[Moonduck]

Any snatch I do is a power snatch, as I'm just not fast enough to do anything else yet. Same thing with my cleans. The clean and jerk winds up being a clean and push press =P

Had a KILLER workout last night. For a deload week, I'm feeling wrecked (in a good way) today. Al and Ron came over, and we didn't have an actual gameplan, so we kicked around ideas. We finally landed on mobility, conditioning, and end it with a barbell complex.

So the workout last night would've made the BW nuts here happy.

Spiderman Mountain Climbers, 20 on each side
Single-leg pushups, 10 per leg
Leg Crossover pushups, 10 per leg
Y-Squats, strict form and DEEP, 20 reps
Random lunge work and squat work, trying to get Al to go deeper

Al, as we have found, has horrendous hip mobility and shoulder mobility issues. His hips are freakin awful, and I have made it my goal to fix the problem. Ron just has absurdly tight hamstrings, and that is easy to work out. Al's so bad that he can't squat with heels on the ground without falling over. He flat can't do it. So we're going to be doing hip mobility from now until whenever his hips loosen up.

His shoulders are a wreck from a mobility standpoint too. He can bench 205#, but can't do one pushup with good form. Hell, he can't do one pushup with bad form. It's awful. If his scaps aren't artificially supported, like on the bench, he's done for upper body strength in the down position.

Worse, I realised last night that his core is weak too. He flat cannot maintain a flat back when doing a push-up, no matter how hard he tries. He wobbles all over the place. So Al gets to do planks, planks, and more planks.

Crikey, I feel like a personal trainer.

Nonetheless, after we did the mobility stuff, and some more BW work, we got into the barbell complex. We did "The Bear". Neither one of them could finish a full set with anything more than 75#. I got up to 120#, and gave 135# a shot. I managed to get 3 reps with 135# before I was told to put down the weight for my own safety. Apparently I came so close to missing the back push press that they thought I was going to brain myself.

I did manage to do something cool though. Playing around with various weights, and trying to illustrate the snatch and power snatch, I managed to power snatch 135# finally. The wierd part was that I did it off of 25#, so the bar was closer to the floor and my barbell path was even longer. Didn't make sense, as this should've made the lift harder. *shrug* Either way, it's a pretty serious PR for me, however unimpressive that number is comparatively.

I feel nicely hammered today. sor ein places that haven't been getting much work lately, and I really like that.

[Moonduck]

D'oh, I forgot to add that we did pull-ups too. My requirement was ten pull-ups, any grip, any number of sets. Ron and I both did it in three, and, oddly enough, both because we miscounted and thought we'd done the tenth rep in the second set. Stupid. Al, for no apparent reason, couldn't even get one. I figured he would do ten singles, and that would be it, but he never even managed to get his nose above the bar. Really strikingly poor performance.

Al will get a steady diet of BW for a few weeks. I feel bad too. I should've done this befor enow. I feel remiss in not getting everyone on the same page with BW before hitting the weights.

Then again, it's not like aI'm a coach or personal trainer. I shouldn't feel responsible for anybody else but me. The problem is that I'm the only one that reads anything about the subject, and the only one that actually thinks abot things like cycles, waves, style of workout, mobility, etc.

[cheesedog]

T-nation had an article about shoulder mobility recently. Some good stuff about scapular work versus rotator cuff work. It seems more people have trouble with the scap than the rotators.

I know what you mean about the personal trainer stuff. When guys at the kickboxing gym talk BW or weight training, almost everyone else is at a caveman level. (Me lift big. Grunt!) When I give ANY advice past a single workout idea I get alot of confused looks. Oh well, at least most of them stretch abit, although they tend to skip shoulders.

By the way, that's a nice mobility/core workout you came up with

[Moonduck]

Thanks for the comments on the mobility/core thing. It's something I came up with on the fly, trying to tailor the movements to areas I knew I knew there were problems in. I actually surprised myself by completing all of it while talking them through the movements. I'd not ever done this myself, so it was flying by the seat of my pants.

That said, proof is in the pudding. After all the craziness yesterday, we did wind up in an actual gym today. With the impending arrival of the power cage, the first thing the lads wanted to do was squat. Warmed my heart, it did. Well, I didn't want to jump into it too fast, so here's what we did:

2 x 2.5 minutes HARD on the rowing machines (and I ahev decided that I LOVE the Concept 2 rower, dammit)
2 x 10 Prisoner squats
2 x 10 back squats with the bar only

Then we began working our way up from there, roughly 20# or so at a time, doing 8-12 reps or so. I wound up pulling a double with 275#. Not great, but better than I've ever done, and not bad at all considering how beat down I was. After last night, I was sore, after the crazy volume getting to 275# in 20# jumps and doing plenty of reps on the way, I'm amazed, and will probably be a trainwreck tomorrow. This will well and truly be a test of my diet insofar as recovery is concerned.

I plan to se eif I can beat 275# on sunday, when we try again. This time I won't wreck myself with volume, and I won't have worked out hard the night before. Maybe I'll see 300# or so. That would be right nice.

After the squat marathon, we just started wandering around hitting random machines HIT style. It was actually a lot of mindless fun, and left me feeling solidly worked out.

Back tot hat proof thing, Al managed to do squats tonight, getting up to 205, and his feet were solidly flat on the floor the whole time. His torso was a wobbly train wreck, with form so bad that another lifter took him off the side afterwards (I'd been cussing at him the whole time and trying to correct him, but the Iron Madness was upon him, and reason was thus useless). Still, while his core was giving out before his legs, his legs were functioning properly! Yay for mobility work!

They also both agreed that more mobility work was definitely needed. I even got Al to agree that BW work was exactly what he needed. It's so nice to see prudent decisions being made, especially when the ego and big weights are involved.

[cheesedog]

:lol: :lol: IRON MADNESS!!!!! 8) 8)
Every real man succumbs to that sometimes, and while it might occasionally hurt you, often it's just what you need to break through to a new level.

When you're cussing yourself the next couple days climbing stairs, just remember the many benefits of IRON MADNESS!!!

[Moonduck]

I'm a bit, *ahem* susceptible to it. My training partners recognise the symptoms well enough to just get out of the way. Just like last night, I wanted more weight, and was being a bit conservative. Figuring on about 255 for my next Jump. Al just looked at me and exasperatedly said 275, and wouldn't take (a very weak) no for an answer. As he explained, I wasn't going to be happy until I got it, and the only reason why I was taking small jumps was because of him not approving. So I needed to just get it out of my system. He was right to. I got my exhausted double, and I was happy. Left it at that.

And, yeah, I wince every time I get out of my car, and every step is walk down. Up is no biggy for some reason, but down. Oh, wow, ow ow ow.

Oddly enough, I have zero pain in my quads. It's all in my hamstrings and hips. My quads are tired, but not blasted. This is good, as it means my muscles were firing properly, and my stace was more or less correct. Al is having massive pain in his quads, so his is not right. *sigh*

[cheesedog]

As Al's mobility gets better he to will be able to experience the lovely sensation of pain in your glutes and hams when you sit down on the toilet! :P

[Moonduck]

Oddly enough, my glutes are not even slightly sore. Just like the quads, my glutes were apparently untouched by last night's bout of IM. My hams hate me with a fierceness, and we won't even go into the hip adductors and abductors. I've felt tugging more than once, making me think they were vainly attempting to slink off and find another pair of legs to be involved with.

Okay, maybe a twinge or two in the quads, but my arse is apparently made of sterner stuff. Hell, even my calves are sore. My back is a mess too. Muscularly speaking, not spinally. We did a lot of pull-downs, rows, etc, and my back muscles are griping at me even as I type this.

The muscle soreness is really telling though. My hips are weak, and my hams are doing all the heavy work as a result. This makes sense, as I've not done any squatting before now, relying on deads for leg developement. This means I' ve glutes that find the 275# I lifted last night to be laughable, hams that are only sore due to sheer overwork, and quads that are probably too shocked to even be sore.

[cheesedog]

Don't be surprised if your quads are more sore in a day or two than today. Delayed soreness can be funny like that.

[Moonduck]

Gee, thanks so much for calling doom upon my quads :P

[Moonduck]

Nah, quads are a little tight, but nothing serious. Hams are still unhappy, and hip flexors are still hatin' me. It' smore a dull griping though, not the shouting and searching for torches and pitchforks like yesterday. Al, however, called me this morning for the sole purpose of cursing my name :twisted:

We construct the power rack tonight. Hope it goes together well.

Also, I've spent some money. An unpleasant amount of money. Hopefully it should yield some good results. I finally bought a few of the items I've been wanting. We had the money, so I bought. Ordered a Monster Stick, and John Berardi's Precision Nutrition. I also have a multi-DVD training seminar put together by Charles Staley coming. Crikey, I can't believe how much money I've spent in the past two days....

Luckily, my wife is really jazzed up about Precision Nutrition. This means she will support it, and that is a good thing, considering how infrequently I actually cook for myself.

[Moonduck]

I hurt. Bad. Ouch. Damn, I'm an idiot.

Yesterday's training:

I mentioned that I found an Oly Lifting club in my area, and I went out yesterday to train with them. I arrive at the coaches house and meet three of his junior lifters, only to find that all three have been national champions at one point or another. Pretty cool to find out that you're lifting with national champs. It was educational too, as these young guys were great just to watch. All three had different proportions and body sizes, and it allowed for ideas on how to deal with a variety of physical differences.

Anyway, the coach did some assessment of my flexibility and ability. I was judged to be adequately flexible in pretty much every areas except my wrists, and not bad there, but obviously an utter n00b on the lifts. In talking with me, he agreed with my thoughts that I had more strength than I was willing to use, as I have confidence issues with ducking uder the bar. As a result, a lot of what I was doing was work on getting under the bar quickly.

5x5 Overhead squats
5x5 Front squats
5x5 Snatch pulls (sucked at these)
5x5 Snatch drops (wow, these are tough)
5x5 Jerks from the rack

All done with about 75#. Sounds easy, but the volume was high considering I've never done a lot of these movements, and never done any of them with any volume.

Then we finished with a crossfit work. F*ck me, but that was hard. 5 stations, 40 seconds a station, just enough time between stations to change places.

1) Rowing machine (they have an older Concept 2, I'm jealous, wantwantwant)
2) Keg crunches (crunches with an empty beer keg held in a full press position above the chest)
3) Duck unders (laterally ducking under a bar set at about waist height)
4) Link swings (basically kettlebell swings with a bloody huge link from a ship's chain)
5) Dumbbell taps (crunch position with feet under dumbbells, 20# hex dumbbel just below waist level on each side, crunch up and tap the left dumbbell with the right hand, then tap right dumbbell with left hand, repeat)

Ouch, damn, hurt. Four rotations through the circuit was the idea. I made it through three before I decided that I didn't really want to puke, and probably would if I did another set of dumbbell taps. I would've felt bad about pussing out, but then I watched the absurdly in-shape junior lifter (ranging in age from 17-20) struggle and flail about uselessly on set four. At that point, I realised that I could've kept going and just taken it easy like they did, the bums :P

Happily, there was a grocery store with a salad bar right around the corner, so I was able to deal with my ravenous hunger immediately after. They're a great group, and I think I will be trying to train with them. I need to arrange my schedule a bit, but I should be able to get at least one session a week in at minimum.

It doesn't end there though. Oh no, I'm not smart enought to call it a day after all that. 2.0 hours of lifting and nearly half an hour of pure crossfit hell wasn't enough.

No, I stil had an evening training session to go, as Sunday is one of my standing days with my normal training partners. I knew they would wuss out if I didn't push it, so I worked out anyway.

It was a simple session, with some stretching and mobility followed by squats (front and rear), overhead pressing, and chin-ups.

Squats were a mix of front and rear squats for me, all rear for them. Started with the bar and added 20-30# per set til we got to 235#, at 5 or so reps a set. They both crapped out at that point, and I really didn't feel like pushing it any farther. Hell, who am I kidding? It was sheer brute willpower that got me that far. I was utterly unwilling to go any more than I absolutely had to, and they were worried about me the whole time anyway.

45# x5
75# x5
105# x5
135# x5
165# x5
185# x5
205# x5
215# x5
235# x3

Overhead pressing started out the same way, escalating 20# a set til we reached 135#.

45# x5
65# x5
85# x5
105# x5
125# x3
135# x1

Then, like an absolute IDIOT, I decided to illustrate jerks with 135#. So here I am totally and completely exhausted, and I'm trying to show how to do an explosive movement. While I failed to show perfect form (shocker), I didn't brain myself either. Yay me.

Because of some comments made, we were collectively shamed into doing some chin-ups. Because we're stupid.

This morning, my hip flexors are positively screaming. My lower back is sore (muscle-wise), my knees are tight, and my shoulders have been secretly replaced with angry bundles of stiffness and pain (again, muscle pain). And we're not even going to talk about my abs and obliques.

4.0 hours of lifting and 0.5 hours of crossfit are a bit much. I'm gonna drag myself upstairs and see about a shower now. Ouch.

[cheesedog]

IRON MADNESS STRIKES AGAIN!!!!!!!!


That was a very tough beginning Oly workout. And then followed with the crossfit circuit of death! That alone would've made you sore as hell. And then squats and overhead presses and chins! Lucky you didn't strain something. Take a couple of days of and eat lots of protein, you earned it.

You are officially insane! I'm proud to know you. :D 8)

[Moonduck]

Take a couple of days of and eat lots of protein, you earned it.

I'm not smart enough for that. Monday's are a workout night, so Al came over (Ron had to get up absurdly early), and brought another friend of ours over. Had it been only Al, I probably would've blown it off, but I rarely get to train with Edith (wife of my unofficial adopted younger brother). So, I did even more stupidty.

Last night, Al wanted to squat some more. So while they did back squats, I worked in fives of the front squat. It allowed me to stay with the weights they were using, thus stressing my back less, and still gave me a worth while level of resistance. Then I moved on to snatch drops, followed by overhead squats, and jerks thrown in as well. It wasn't terribly organised, else I'd go over what I did. I was also still thoroughly exhausted, and thus I don't exactly remember what the weights were, or the reps, or the sets.

Fuck, I'm stupid...

I did get up to 205# in the front squats, a new PR. Yeah, I PR'ed in the front squats while exhausted and mentally foggy. Urrr, I lift gud. *scratches* Also got up to 135# in the overhead squat, another PR, I think. Lost it on the third rep though, and almost crashed into the front of the power rack (our rack is too short for me to do overhead work).

135# proved to be a bit much to ask with jerks though. By then, I was too blasted in the shoulders and arms from the snatch drops to put forth more than a token effort. 125# was my best jerk with good technique. 135# kept turning into push presses. Happily, the push presses were dead easy, but I wanted to bang em up to proper lock-out. I was just too wrecked.

Edith, being the endurance freak, wasn't properly finished afterwards, so Al asked me to come up with something brutal as a finisher. So here I am, exhausted, foggy, having done something like 9 sets total of front and overhead squats, after working out for 4 hours plus the day before, and he wants me to come up with something brutal?

Well, the bar happened to be resting on the low pics, so I thought of Waterbury Walks. I loaded it up with 135# and did Waterbury Walks for 10 reps, with both hands in an overhand grip to add in extra joy for the forearms. Al and Edy both did the first set, but she decided to bug out before the second one. Al wisely suggested that we eschew the second set ourselves, as his hips were killing him. Me? Well, for once, I wasn't stupid, and agreed.

Interestingly, my Monster Stick arrived yesterday, and I got to use it on myself and Al. He's a wreck soft-tissue wise, with massive problems in his legs. He was damned near crying and was actively yelping while I works his calves and hips. Careful study of his squat technique has revealed unsettling news though. He has a leg imbalance, with one leg shorter than the other. When he hit bottom on the swuat, his ass shifts over almost two inches towards the left side due to the length/mobility differences. God, he's a trainwreck. One problem after another, the poor guy.

Today, however, is a rest day. I only did a few jerks and squat drops with an empty bar, and a couple of pull-ups. Some days I wonder about my sanity.

You are officially insane! I'm proud to know you.

Thanks, I think. :lol:

[cheesedog]

I did the Waterbury walks during a cycle a few months ago. They SOUND easy, until you do 'em.

My wife has told me before that I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it! Looks like you're in the same boat... :D

[Moonduck]

Pretty much.

All I've done is the occassional jerk with an empty bar, and, damn, it hurts.

And I like it. I'm stupid.

[Moonduck]

Wednesday turned into "test for 10-rep max" day in squats and overhead press. 'Cause I can't slow down, I guess. The numbers were okay. Nothing great, but okay. I think I may retest for 10RM on front squat, and work FS while the guys work back squats. It'll cut down a little bit on my tonnage, but it is more sport-specific to the oly lifts. I'm wondering if my wrists can take huge volume on FS though. Guess we'll see.

I don't exactly recall how much we lifted. We just loaded 20# on the bar for each, doing 5's til is got hard, then we did 8's. If we felt we might be at the tenner, we shot for ten. I had trouble judging, so I did 3 sets to 10 before I really hit the wall. By then, I think it was less my legs giving out and mor emy core. It had been a long damned week, and it was only wednesday.

Presses were a bit easier. I got up to a surprising weight for me. Traditionally I am weak in the overhead press. My previous tested sorta max was only 135#. I managed to get 125# up 10 times, with the tenth being an all-out grinding effort. So 125# it is, and I really don't mind. I positively HAVE to get my press up seriously if I want to go anywhere with the oly lifts. Same with my front squat (and overhead squat of course).

Like an idiot, I decided to do a quick snatch drop and see if I could pump out a fiver in the overhead squat with 125#. Dumb, but it was there, so I'm gonna try. I failed to lockout, and lost it just before. The bar came down fast and bounced off the back of my skull taking a chunk of skin with it. Hurt like the dickens, and I cussed a bit. The guys knew I was okay because of the cussing, so they had a good laugh over it. Ribbed me a good bit too. But, hey, at least the iron has been fed some blood. It'll lift better now, or at least that is what I tell myself.

Friday was supposed to be "workout with my wife" night. But she wants a new program, we're still hashing out details, and we realised that she's been doing this for 4 weeks now, so I told her to take a deload week. She was more than happy to do so, and so was I. Now I have to get a program together for her. (I'll be posting another thread for her program, hoping to get some feedback there).

So I've gone a couple of days without training. Given my recent schedule, it feels wierd. I think it'll be a good thing though, as I've pushed WAY hard. We'll see. Tomorrow starts a new DeLorme Cycle, and it is gonna start with a heavy day, so volume, volume, volume.

Wish me luck. Or, alternatively, wish me IRON MADNESS!!

[cheesedog]

I'll wish you both luck AND iron madness! Sounds like you need it!

[Moonduck]

Well, started the new DeLorme cycle tonight. It was nowhere near as rough as I expected. The previous cycle left me pretty darned well tanked at the end of heavy night. This time, not so much. Oddly enough though, the squats were still a beast. More a test of will than anything else.

This may be because we weren't doing them straight through like before. Our weight ranges weren't quite so varied, so it made sense to make minor weight changes and let someone else work into the set than to make huge weight changes constantly and have everyone do it all alone. It may have allowed too much rest time, thus causing me to feel less blasted. I'm not sure if this is a good thing, or a bad thing.

The really wierd thing were the overhead presses. I figured they were going to destroy me, but they were actually kinda easy. I'm looking forward to upping the weight. Wierd. I actually outdid Al, the overhead press top dog in our little trio.

We also had a special guest star tonight. An old friend of our came by and deicded to work out. He is your typical fat guy computer geek (y'know, like I was last year) so he was in big trouble very quickly. He did amdirably well though, and has good hip mobility. His shoulders are WAY tight though. It's a curse, I swear. I can loosen up hips. Shoulders I'm clueless on...

That said, this guy may join us on a regular basis now, as Al is starting a new job and they'll be working together. Al plans on getting food and coming over straight over to my place on training nights. Makes sense as he works a coupla miles from my house now. This means he can drag pasty computer geekboy with him. Not sure how I'm gonna work a 4th person in. We're gonna run into limitations with facilities, as my garage is only so big. =P

[Moonduck]

NOTE: The FNG (Fat New Guy) got to do a pile of BW before he even started in on any sort of assessment. Once I found that he could do BW squats (surprisingly) well enough, then I put him under a bar.

[cheesedog]

Hmm, maybe all that OH pressing and jerks have had almost a "greasing the groove" effect? And the longer rest periods likely helped too.

On the subject of shoulder loosening, I have been doing an exercise for the last few weeks I've christened the "bosco" in honor of Harry B. Paschall (an old time bodybuilder and Olympic weightlifter) who created a cartoon character back in the '40s named Bosco. (You can check out his stuff on The Golden Age Of Iron Men website. Tons of interesting info, and some things that are mind-numbingly boring.)

Anyway, to do the exercise you lie back on a low incline bench with a light dumbell in each hand and start in a "flye" position but instead of moving up and down you SLOWLY bring the weights up in an almost parellal to the ground arc (so you are stretching the chest and shoulders through their entire range of motion) until the weights are overhead and stretched out behind your head. Kinda hard to explain. Think of it as doing the arm motions of a jumping jack, but on an incline and with more stretch. Trust me, start LIGHT with this--tight muscles are sensitive muscles. 5# is enough at first, I don't usually go over 10#.

[Moonduck]

I think I'm getting this. Sort of like making a snow angel, except you're on a bench.

[koltz]

I think ill join in this post ...

Tried any 'basic' KSHD \ VRT?
it's very good it's like theres weights,bodyweight,machines , etc
and theres it that many options.

[Moonduck]

What is KSHD? VRT, from what I saw, looks to be something akin to isometrics with visualisation, is that right?

[koltz]

it's not isometrics since you go through the full ROM
it's not visualization because you don't have to.

it's more like providing the resistance with the antagonist muscles , and yes it works. and got many many applications ,

but you don't just flex your triceps and biceps and move around your forearm , theres focus , correct breathing , concentration , clarity management (you can black out if you do it wrong)

and probably a meditative quality to it (reverse meditation)


can be used in anywhere from stretching , max efforts : to cardio
or to make an easy movement (like a push up) harder (it's more difficult to do it right when external resistance , even light is involved)

[Moonduck]

Interesting. What sort of effect does it have? I can imagine that you would see some hypertrophy, but what about limit strength? And what sort of affect does it have on connective tissues and hard tissues?

The way you describe it, it sounds more like "Push Yourself to Power" or whatever the name of that book was. Self-applied resistance.

[cheesedog]

I think Koltz is referring to "dynamic resistance" where you are doing a motion (say, a punch) in slow motion with maximum tension, Using your bicep and back muscles to resist your pecs, shoulders, and tri's, while visualizing pushing a mountain, huge block of stone, etc.

I have done two dynamic resistance forms in the past, (I don't do them as often now as there is some concern that doing them too much raises blood pressure) called Sanchin (from Okinawan karate) and Iron Wire (from Hung Gar kung-fu). They are good for "ingraining" the movements of your fighting art (punch, block, kick,etc.,) and you get a nice muscle pump. I got a nice increase in endurance but as far as I could tell, no strength or mass increase. If you don't have blood pressure concerns they should be good for active recovery. Also very easy on the joints.

Almost forgot, describing the bosco as making snow angels on a bench is exactly what I was trying to say, but just didn't quite....So many words, so many wasted :P

[Moonduck]

Well, I had them do the bosco tonight. It was like watching a train wreck in slow motion.

We did our light night tonight. Had a full house too. Adrian came back, and so did Edith, as well as the normal two that come over. We officially had way more people than space or bars. So, Al and I busted out the standard bar and some 25's, and we went outside to train it old school style - power clean to front squat, then bang out the reps from there. Al was having massive trouble with the front squat, so his was more like power clean then push press into back squat position, rep from there. Exciting. We also did our overhead pressing that way.

Lemme tell ya, it was way more work than intended. I'm a bit wrecked, and we were only using about 125#. Then again, I also did some clean & jerk work, snatch drops, and overhea dsquats, as well as sundry dips and pull-ups, so I did work myself a little bit.

I think I'm just gonna adopt IRON MADNESS as my official slogan. Hell, that would make a killer tat. Use a font similar to the one used on Iron Maiden album covers. Damn, that would own.

I've been up too long, and need to go to bed.

[cheesedog]

Yep, when your shoulders are tight, boscos hurt at first. It feels so good when you stop though!

Moonduck, it sounds like you and your crew are having some AWESOME workouts. 8) Keep it up!

[Moonduck]

It would be more awesome if we had more space. And another weight set wouldn't hurt. Oddly enough, the others started talking about buying another weight set without any input from me. Maybe we'll see someone aside from Ron (who bought the power rack) and me (who bought every flippin thing else) putting some money into our collective Courage Corner.

I will say, there was an awesome purity about standing outside with nothing but the barbell and producing a tolerable leg and shoulder workout. Sure, my heart rate may have elevated as much from fear of doing squats without a squat rack, but it was still elevated!

Now, if I could only get my clean up to 225#, then I could really do some serious legwork. Of course this would mean that my wrists, elbows, and shoulders were up to the task of doing 225# in the front squat, and that ain't happening yet. For now, I'm happy to be able to do tens with that weight in back squats. I need to get the arms/wrists/shoulders more flexible, and more willing to stand the rigors of the FS. Getting my arms in the prope rposition is really the biggest thing, too. Gotta get to where the delts are supporting the bar, and the hands are just securing it.

[koltz]

hmm actually I'm taking the KSHD thing into higher levels then just 'flex and move'
I'm looking to see if a thought pattern that can generate tension ' keep it , and not have your mind blown off as well as get a feel at how much you are really giving into it

, and yes the blood pressure thing is right , when you release the tension you become RED actually morel like this red brown and I'm a very white Russian guy...
and when you move a certain limb with it it goes white actually , since when theres 60%+ muscular tension the blood flow the the muscle is cut off...
so it's pretty funny to see..

as far as gains go , i have gained a lot of strength lose some fat and gained some mass ,

[Moonduck]

Wednesday was another full house. And we had another one show up, Adrian girlfriend. Utterly untrained, though she does Tai Chi. I'm getting to be of the opinion that Tai Chi has about as much worth as yoga. She goes to tai chi class 2-3 times a week, and has been doing it for months, and she is still in awful shape. Admittedly, better shape than she was in, as she's lost a lot of weight, but she's as weak as a kitten, telling me either she's lost muscle mass as well, or that she's been weak all along and tai chi isn't helping.

Still, I have a 1.5 car garage, and a whole lotta crap in said garage. Having six freaking people over to lift is ridiculous. We wound up sticking the newbs outside doing benchwork with Ron, Al, and I rotating into coach/spotter position for them between our sets. In short, it was a crap training session. Too many bloody interruptions, time wasted explaining every bloody little thing, etc. I don't mind helping people. Hell, I enjoy it, but when I'm under the bar, I don't need to be pestered constantly.

Still, I banged out the weights with no problems and no real soreness/stiffness. Decided to push for a "sorta max", as Coach Dan John calls it, in overhead press. I wanted to see where I was, so I can track any improvements. I made 145# twice, but couldn't manage 150# once. Irritating. It didn't help that I kept getting interrupted while doing it. Christ, can't people see that you're trying to do something when you're addressing the frikken bar? My mindset was utterly blown, and that's why I think I couldn't get 150# past the stickig point just over my head.

Grrr. I feel unfulfilled. I know I could've had 150#. I doubled 145# for goodness' sake. I hate sessions like that...

[cheesedog]

Is there any chance you could get a new place to lift? Maybe if everyone chips in and you basically start your own "private gym". I think that's how Westside Barbell started.

You could call it the "IRON MADNESS GYM" 8) 8)

Speaking of Tai Chi, too bad it's usually taught in such a way as to completely devoid it of any martial application. Or if any applications are taught they're completely useless. Properly taught it can be pretty deadly.

And you'll get the 150# next time because you're PISSED OFF! :twisted:

[Moonduck]

*blink* That would require money. I barely afford to buy new equipment as-is. Stil, it would be dead cool, and "IRON MADNESS" would make a killer name for a hard-core lifting gym...

As to the tai chi practitioner, she asked for some weights to do her forms with while waiting ont he bench to clear. I cycled her through lighter and lighter weights trying to find something that worked. She got down to the 2.5# mini-plates, and still couldn't get through any more than a handful of poses. I can hardly feel any weight at all with 2.5# plates, and she was getting exhausted and having issues. Isn't tai chi an art that includes sword-work? How the heck can someone that can't tote a 2.5# plate going to work a lion head sword?

And, yeah. I'm gonna get 150# and I'm gonna bang it up with no issues. I am pissed. I HATE being unfinished like that. And I will probably tell the chaff to clear out when I do it. I don't need distractions when putting iron overhead.

[Moonduck]

*blink* That would require money. I barely afford to buy new equipment as-is. Stil, it would be dead cool, and "IRON MADNESS" would make a killer name for a hard-core lifting gym...

As to the tai chi practitioner, she asked for some weights to do her forms with while waiting ont he bench to clear. I cycled her through lighter and lighter weights trying to find something that worked. She got down to the 2.5# mini-plates, and still couldn't get through any more than a handful of poses. I can hardly feel any weight at all with 2.5# plates, and she was getting exhausted and having issues. Isn't tai chi an art that includes sword-work? How the heck can someone that can't tote a 2.5# plate going to work a lion head sword?

And, yeah. I'm gonna get 150# and I'm gonna bang it up with no issues. I am pissed. I HATE being unfinished like that. And I will probably tell the chaff to clear out when I do it. I don't need distractions when putting iron overhead.

[koltz]

tai chi is lame , look how much the chineese govmnt likes it , and how it killed off millions of chi gong participators.

chigong is the real thing I bet.



btw , that reminds me of that fancy jumprope I used to have :\

tried doing weighted rope skipping? it's awesome.

[Sepanto]

O_O... I took a lesson in Chiqong Ichiwan, and it rocks. Tai Chi is potentially awesome, but only if it is really well taught, otherwise it sucks.

[Moonduck]

I am no where near coordinated enough to jump rope. Seriously, you could film me with a jump rope, add a laugh track, and you could probably sell copies. It's pathetic.

[cheesedog]

Tai Chi IS qigong, if done properly. Actually, almost anything can be qigong, including weightlifting, once you understand how.
But yeah, tai chi is lame 98% of the time as taught.

About the swordwork, I think that's usually reserved for more advanced practitioners.

[cheesedog]

By the way moonduck, LOVE the new sig line! 8)

[koltz]

btw anyone can explain how that guy pulled a truck with his penis then?

[Moonduck]

Koltz, you know that study where they kept tugging on the bird's wing and it became immensely strong? That would be how that guy got to where he could pull a truck with his Wedding Tackle.

Thanks for the compliment on the sig, Cheesedog. I figured you'd like it. Also, Koltz, that pic is awesome. I did a little bit of playing around with the Two-Hands Anyhow. That is one freaky hard lift, regardless of weight. The technique demands are brutal. In other words, I like it. I just need to get to the point where I can do it with a barbell like Arthur Saxon is doing in that pic.

--

Well, Training Session 1 for the day is done.

Snatch Drops 6x5
Overhead Squats 2x5
Jerks 3x5, 3x3
Hang cleans with front squats 6x5 or so
A bunch of random BW stuff thrown in for warm-up and limbering

Coach cut me loose early. He knew that I was lifting tonight as well, and didn't feel like over-working me. He's a good guy.

Tongith should be... interesting. After a week's worth of shitty sessions, I'm pretty grumpy. I'll be having words with my crew tonight. Things are gonna change. I'll be chasing MY goals. Anyone that doesn't want to chase MY goals can do so, but they'll be writing their own programs. I am officially tired of writing programs that wind up being utterly boring and mediocre because too many people aren't willing to JFL*.

So I'm gonna write the programs for me, and any half-ass goldbrickers that don't want to keep up will be given the oppurtunity to quit when their personal work-level tolerance has been exceeded. I'm am not gonna play personal trainer/coach to 6 different people and try to have programs ready that will halfway fit everyone's needs.

The bottom line is that I lift for ME, period. At that point, the programs I write will be for ME. The only person that will get any leeway at all is Ron, because, well, he paid for the power rack. He deserves some leeway.

[cheesedog]

Can't blame you at all for getting tired of being the unpaid personal trainer and coach. Sometimes people will take advantage, (usually without really meaning too) when you give TOO much. There's gotta be some give and take.

That a nice o-lift workout coach put you through.

[Moonduck]

Well, I laid it on em tonight. Credit to them, they weren't all that defensive, and understood. Al got a little pissy, but only becaus eI belaboured a particular point that he was guilty of. He's the one handing out invites willy-nilly, and is the reason why we had so many people last week.

It wasn't all that much better tonight. We had two more than usual, but at least they were here to lift.

I laid it out, and we're going to go Westside conjugated method, using the Elite FTS Beginners template. Complex, and worky, but the program has a long history of results. And it is flexible enough that I can work some of my oly stuff in with no real issues.

All five of us tested for max. Adrain was the worst, at 135#, but it was largely his shoulders. He flat could not get under the bar and hold the back squat position at all. The front squat was marginally better, but he couldn't take the pressure on his wrists. Sad, because it is not a strength issue. He casually deadlifted 225# shortly after. Shoulder issues suck.

Alan, another newb, stunned us all. He is horribly out of shape, and well-known to be an utter wuss when it comes to exercise, yet he managed to squeeze 195# out. What made this even more impressive, in my eyes, is that this is not only the first time he has done back squats, but also the first time he has tried to lift with us. His pasty, fat geek ass did right well.

Ron put up a respectable 255# and Al did 295#, both of which were 50# higher than previous attempts about 3 weeks ago. They practise we've done has grooved the move in a good amount. I did a tolerable 355lbs. I wanted more. Got under 365lb and got it up without reeeeally straining, but missed parallel by about 1.5". I decided not to try it again as I felt like I was pushing my luck. I was getting jumpy and punchy, and the adrenaline was already singing. In other words, Iron Madness was upon me, and ha dbeen for a while. It took a VERY slow, grinding 365# to snap me out of it. I knew right then that if I hit depth I wasn't going to come back up, so I figured 355# was a-okay.

And, most importantly, I feel thoroughly worked. I'm also thoroughly hungry, and I am going to go enjoy some well-earned post-workout nutrition.

[Moonduck]

Sorry, forgot to post the progression.

45# x5
75# x5
105# x5
135# x5
165# x3
195# x3
225# x3
255# x2
275# x2
305# x1
315# x1
325# x1
335# x failed on depth, x1
345# x1
355# x failed on depth, x1
365# x failed on depth, x stopped by training partners that are smarter than I am

Tonnage was 3.25, unimpressive on that standpoint, but the intensity and density were both solid.

And, yes, my legs are hammered right now. 2 hours of oly lifts at midday and another 2.5 hours of heavy squats (with warm-up and cool-down in each period) has left its' mark on me. I'm hurtin'. On the upside, my thighs are still swole right now. Rawr.

Thinking on it, I'm wondering how much endurance failure played in that. 365# was a grinder, but I'm wondering if it was all the freaky work done before hand that cause me to miss it. I don't feel like I could've done a lot more weight, but I think I could've hit 365#.

Ah, pssh, woulda, shoulda, coulda. Whatever. 355# ain;t bad for the first time I've tested for max on squats. Heh, and I've only had 2 real squat sessions before that, so I guess I shouldn't complain.

[Moonduck]

Did test for bench max tonight. I know mine, so I'm not concerned with it. I worke din just to get some training on. Not bad. Alan continued to impress, putting up 185#, not bad at all for an untrained pasty-faced geekboy.

[Moonduck]

Went for another "weighted" bike ride today. My legs have been all sorts of jacked up since the max squat thing, and I figured some serious, repetitive, concentric-only work would be the magic button for my legs and hips. Yup, it was.

I figured this out Sunday, by the way. My legs and hips had been aching since Wednesday's squat session. Yeah, Wednesday. Not hurting bad, but still aching. Well, Saturday I decided to do a trail ride with a buddy of mine. My wife was making a pretty serious St Patrick's Day dinner and I wanted to earn my carbs. So I went out, pushed through the ache, and banged out a good ride (complete with sprint intervals in the middle). My legs felt completely great Sunday when I warmed up for oly practice.

After a 40 minute ride with 80# behind the bike, my legs feel ten times better than they did this morning. They still hurt, don't get me wrong, but I don't feel like I've been kicked a few hundred times.

[cheesedog]

Yep, it's amazing what some concentric only exercise can do for soreness. I often use the bike the same way. The Westside guys do sled pulls for the same reason. I don't have a sled but I found pulling and pushing my Wavemaster heavybag around the workout room was a decent alternative. My wife comes in and just stares for a moment, shakes her head, and goes downstairs. I get that a lot...

[Moonduck]

My wife comes in and just stares for a moment, shakes her head, and goes downstairs. I get that a lot...

Story of my life, brother. Story of my life...

[cheesedog]

Reminds me of the first time my wife went to Karate class with me. We had only been dating a couple of months and I thought she should see how I was spending a big chunk of my life. That particular class was mostly form work and groundfighting. Afterward I asked her what she thought. She was silent for a few moments and then she said, "I didn't see much karate, all you guys did was dance and hug!"

Oh, she's a pistol! :roll: :D

[Moonduck]

I read that to my wife, and she got a good laugh from it =)

Last night was test for Deadlift max. And it was a night of PR's, wow. Huge PR's. Awesome lifts IMO.

It looks like Adrian and Alan might actually last, and Alan continues to impress. Apparrently there is a deep, deep vein of GeekRage in that lad, and he is tapping into it to produce lifts that are surprising everyone. If he continues to train and push, he could become one of the strongest members of our little crew. And let me tell you how freaking crazy it is to say that.

Alan is your classic underachiever. He is an utter wimp that generally considers a job a success if he manages to keep it for more than six months. He has an orca-fat harridan of a wife that he married because she was the first female to give him any sort of sex without an explicit transaction for money. He has skiny legs, skinny arsm, whines about damned near everything, and a belly that would do a Boston cop proud.

Years ago, I spent some time with Alan trying to teach him the rudiments of boxing. I had him throwing punches into my open hands (two reasons, 1st I had no focus mitts around, 2nd he couldn't squash a fly with the force he was using). Well, he kept dropping his hands when he punched. I kept telling him to keep his hands up, he kept dropping them. I told him that if he dropped his hands again, I was gonna slap him. He did, and I did. Nothing big, an open-hand slap the upper side of his head, from my off-hand and with no body mechanics. The sort of thing that stings good, but won't hurt. WHAM! He went down like I'd pole-axed him, holding the side of his head and holding back tears. And he didn't get back up for a minute or two. Crazy. 99% of the people in the world would've just been rocked a little bit, and kept right on going, learning to keep their hands up. He fell out. Credit to him, he got back in after two minutes prone, and another ten minutes recovering, but it was still pitiful.

(NOTE: Yes, I felt guilty for flooring him. It was like kicking a sick kitten.)

And yet he lifts, and lifts damned well. Sure, his form needs work, and he tends to whine about it afterwards, and he always whines about soreness afterwards. But he gets under the bar and SHINES. I'm so proud of him it hurts.

(2nd NOTE: Alan is a friend of mine, and has been for better than ten years. He has heard everything I've just said in the past, and would agree with my assessments. He is a wimp, and he admits it. Happily, it disgusts him, and I think that is one reason why he is willing to get out and lift with us. Frankly, if I can help de-wimp him a bit, I will consider it one of the more impressive, and worthwhile, accomplishments of my life.)

Moving on...

Adrian continues to be plagued by old injuries and arthritis. I'm personally unconvinced that it is as bad as he makes it out to be. I have the sneaking suspiscion that he is using it as a crutch to excuse away poor effort. Some of it is certainly legit, but he does not produce the effort that anyone else does. Still, he pulled 275# before claiming his hips were giving out.

Alan managed to pull 315#, and did so in Sumo Stance. We found that it worked better for his tight calves and hams. 315#, and he'd never even thought about deadlifting before this week. Not bad for a pasty-faced geekboy.

Al pulled 20# more than his previous PR, with 385#. Ron also bettered his best by 30#, pulling a solid 355#. And I, as usual, lead the pack, increasing my own PR by 30# as well, to 445#. And I felt like I could've done more, stopping because the guys told me that my eyes were all bloodshot from too much blood pressure.

445#, damn. Felt good to pull that. We were running out of weight, and had to pull the ballast plates off the back of the power cage as I'd used up all the normal floor weight. The best part was that it wasn't even a max effort slow grinder. It wasn't quick, not at all, but it didn't take time to grind the weight up. It was a steady pull from floor to just before lockout, and it really popped at lockout. That's why I know I can do more.

The fun part was tallying up my maxes. If I were to hit all of my current (sorta) max lifts in a meet, I'd make Class IV in powerlifting. Rawr, I'm on the boards. Barely, sure, but I'm there. Add in squat suits and bench shirts and the like, and I'm well into Class III. If I meet my goals, I'll be Class III, looking at Class II by end of year. Gotta shoot high, y'know?

All in all, a very good night, and, happily, I'm not really all that sore or stiff right now. Some minor soreness in my back, and some stiffness in the legs, but overall, I feel great. My left pec continues to be tight, no idea why, and it is really starting to concern me, but otherwise I don't feel like I pulled 445# last night :D

[cheesedog]

Wow, you guys are having some frickin' awesome workouts! Keep up the good work. Major props on the new PR! Sounds like it's time to buy a few more big plates, you lucky dog. 8)

Tell Alan to keep tapping into that GeekRage, it can be a powerful force when channelled physically (and away from computer games!)

[Moonduck]

Well, more big plates are probably not in my future purchase plans just yet. I've still got more ballast plates I can use. I dislike the 35# plates out of personal preference, and use them as ballast all the time. If need be, they can be recruited, and I'll have enough weight for now.

The biggest reason why no more big wheels will be purchased is that I'm about to make a few major acquisitions, and that's gonna be a LOT of money out of my trainin gbudget, as it were. I found a 90kg solid rubber bumper set and tolerably good bar for a bit over $500, S&H included. Gonna jump all over that.

I also found a guy local that is selling a very nice, gym-quality magnetic rowing machine for $350 (retails for about a grand) and plan to grab that too. So no cash left over for more wheels :D

[cheesedog]

With the bumper plates you won't need 'em for a while anyway. That's a heck of a deal on the rowing machine. Love them for HIIT!

[koltz]

hey , get your crew over here.

btw - damm you made me want to deadliftI started dead lifting recently and I haven't reached even a 20-30RM weight yet (jsut for safety , that's what happens when you don't DL from the start) I'm at 110KG at the moment @75KG 1.76cm I think ill be in the free strength ride till 200-250KG maybe 300if I could grip it considering I didn't do any ham work compared to upper body

[Moonduck]

Just got back from some HIIT. My daughter has to be picked up from the bus stop after school. It's only about amile away, but she's 6, so we pick her up. Well, I like to attach the kid trailer to my bike and do it that way. Usually we go for a nice 30-40 minute ride, which would be the weighted rides I talk about. Today, I didn't really have time, so I just did a series of tabata bike sprints while waiting on the bus. And now my legs are jacked...

[Moonduck]

200-250kg will be pretty darned good at 75kg bodyweight. Heck, 110kg ain't bad , as it is basically 1.5 times bodyweight. I'm only at 1.8 times bodyweight. When I hit 2 times bodyweight, I'll be happier. 2.5 times will be huge.

I love the deadlift. Then again, I'm built for it, with long arms and a short torso. But I love the lift. It is my favourite max effort, and the one I feel safest pushing my limits on. I'm still not quite in the groove with squatting yet. Been way too long since I did it a lot.

[koltz]

anyway get some of your guys to post here , we need members. (and the admits back or make me one haha)

[hara_12]

I know the crossfit guys like the rowing machines as well. What is so special about them that you can't do on an airdyne? Are they worth dropping 500$ for when I can get a bike for 5$ at a garage sale?

What are some good brands of rowers out there?

Craig

[cheesedog]

My personal goal for deadlift right now is double bodyweight. I'll get there in time. My goals for bench and squat are quite a bit more non-aggressive; I just want to slowly add strength with good form without getting re-injured!

I think both the airdyne and rower are valuable, they just shift the intensity. Even with the arm motion the bike is still a lower body dominent exercise, while the rower throws more emphasis on the upper body. My rower is a decent but not great model (Precor brand), don't really know much about others.

[Moonduck]

Well, for one, bikes don't work the upper body or the core, while rowers do. Look at the rowing motion. You use your legs (both anterior and posterior), you core (anterior and posterior again), your upper back, your biceps ond long tris, your forearms, and you get great metabolic work from it. Even a bike that has an upper bod component doesn't do that much. It's just concentric contraction to continue your spin, and very moderate arm work.

If you give a good rowing ergometer a try, you'll find out very quickly why the Crossfit people like them so much. I tried a Concept2 as my first ride, and I would LOVE to own one. They're great, seriously.

As to why they're so expensive and bikes are cheap, well, that right there gives you a clue. As usual, you get what you pay for. Bikes are cheap, they're all over the place, and they show up for sale used all the time. Why? Because they really aren't that great (unless you know how to use them and are serious about it). The stationary bike, used like 99% of the people out there, is probably the worst piece of cardio equipment for actual usefulness.

A good rowing ergometer has to be built far different, and has more moving parts. It also has to withstand a lot of pressure in multiple directions. In short, they need to be construct4ed better because of all the motion going on.

Overall, a Concept2 is the easiest choice. The reason I say that is pretty simple - go into any conditioning room for any rowing crew in existence. Odds are VERY good that you will see row after row of Concept2 ergs. Why? Because they're great machines. They're sturdy, solid, reliable, and built to last. All of these are important when you consider how many hours a crew team member is going to put in on one. Most gyms that ergs are likely to have Concept2's as well.

I won't be getting one though. Why? Not for lack of desire. It's simply economics. Very few people sell a Concept2 once they buy it. You don't buy an $800+ piece of workout kit on a whim usually. You invest in it because you plan to use it for the long term. So the used market for Concept2's is thin to begin with, and prices are high as a result. The best one I could find was around $600 used, and S&H to get it to me would put it damned close in price to a new one.

Th one I found is a Tunturi R760. It's a magnetic rower. I've not used it before, and will be seeing it, and using it, for the first time tomorrow. Similarly priced, and similarly sturdy, it's a strong, gym-quality erg built to last. When I train, I've got 5-6 people in my garage gym with me, and none of us are small guys. If I buy some cheapo Walmart erg, it's gonna break in 6 months. Money down the drain. So I'm gonna spend the cash to buy a good erg at the outset, and will save money in the long run (hopefully), because it will take the abuse.

Personally, ignore the stationary bike. Buy a real bike. Real biking is good cardio. Wind resistance is serious business, and will beat you down on a windy day. And nothing beats grinding it up a steep hill and then bombing down the other side. Real biking has intervals built in by virtue of constantly changing grade, terrain, etc. I prefer trailriding personally. Sprints and coasts, up and down. It's like my very own HIIT and it a load of fun. Stationary bikes? Pssh, ya go nowhere, you're not doing a difficult movement, bah. Any exercise that can be done while reading a magazine is not worth doing.

A rowing erg, however, will eat you for lunch. Sure, you can mosey along and barely tug it, but if you're working, wow, you're gonna feel it. A good erg will have a proper computer and can be set for intervals, split timing, set for distance, etc.

In short, I don't want to look like a hamster, so why should I train like one?

[Moonduck]

My personal goal for deadlift right now is double bodyweight.

I want double bodyweight on both squat and DL. I'm about 40# from that goal on DL, and I plan to smack that particular number around here in the next coupla months. My initial goal for the YEAR was a 500# Deadlift. Gonna have to revise that number. I think it is a bit too conservative :twisted:

I want a 500# squat too. It ain't too much to ask. Consider my first squat progression attempt ended at 275# and my second, 2 weeks later, ended at 355#, I don't think it will be terribly long before I'm looking at 5 wheels. 5 Wheels, damn, that sounds good. I did 4.5 wheels on DL last night, and lemme tell ya, that looks good on the bar.

My bench is another story. Last time I was working a bench cycle, I maxed at 245#, aka 1 x bodyweight. Whee. I worked a bench progression Monday night, and couldn't get over 225#. I was NOT happy. Still, form was awful, my head wasn't in the right spot, and my delts and tris are in a constant state of fried due to all the oly work I've been doing. It's all excuses though. The bottom line is that I just wasn't motivated enough to push hard. I felt bombed, admitted it, and pushed like a wuss as a result. I HATE it when I do that. I think that why I was in Animal Mode last night on the deads.

That is my current goal, by the way. 350# on bench and 500# on squat and deadlift. I figure I'll hit the last two by mid-year, if things go well. We'll see on the first though.

[koltz]

yesterday I Imagined what would be pulling 660 (300K)be like like the amount of plates on the bar and the rate coding to the muscle.
I got dizzy just form thinking about it and had to rest on the sink ( it was in the shower) I won't be able to pull it off for probably 20 years and probably at no less then 220lbs if I ever will be , but it's so fucking sweet to think about it almost like sex haha.

it's a 4x BW deadlift , has to be a world record :) damm I would love to pull that...


anyway , heres something that might actually interest you ,
making a decent apprentus for rowing like in a machine is easy.
it's not 5$ but you could make somethign that won't be too ugly and work well.
basically you need some springs , something to put your legs on , and handles , and you can just sit and row anywhere and it's the same motion. (and buy a heart rate monitor with the rest of your money if you want to track your cals)

another way would be attaching the spring to somewhere immobile and row while sitting on pillow and pushing it with your legs.


then again , there are better forums of cardio then rowing that take absolutely nothing.

[hara_12]

Thanks for the info. It clears the mud a little for me.

Craig

[Moonduck]

Heh, I'd like to pull a 4xBW deadlift too, as it would be world-class =P

[Moonduck]

<==== Dumbass

Today was the first meeting of the Tidewater Kettlebell Club, a new group being put together by a local instructor. I figured I'd go, see if I could pick up a trick or two, be social, etc. I figured tomorrow is the hardest day of the training week for me, so I didn't need to blast myself on what should be a rest day, right? Yeah, we know what happened, right?

IRON MADNESS!!!

It all started when one of the guys offered to let me try out his KB's. I've got a weedy lil 16kg bell, and I stoppe dusing it because it was just too light. Playing with the 24kg, 32kg, and 40kg bells was a BLAST.

The next thing I know, I'm doing swings, switch-off swings, cleans, presses, snatches, KB juggling (that was unpleasant), and TGU's. Rawr. Damned good fun.

I am now pleasantly tired, and am worrying about how wrecked I'm gonna be for Oly lifting tomorrow. Heh, Coach is probably gonna laugh at my folded ass.

[cheesedog]

That danged Iron Madness strikes again!

Kettlebells are awesome, I'm gonna get a few someday...I do many of the same exercises with dumbells, but I know KB are a different animal entirely.

Turkish Get-ups are a great exercise, it's been too lo